Jump to content

Western Civilization’s Last Stand

The Art of The Argument

Available Now | artoftheargument.com

Freedomain Radio Amazon Affiliate Links: United States - Canada - United Kingdom

Sign up for the Freedomain Mailing List: fdrurl.com/newsletter

tarker12

Dealing with childhood trauma, part of me still wants to "quit"

Recommended Posts

Hey yall,

I have been off the forums (was of course still donating) for about 4 years but still on board with FDR's message. I am having some depression issues lately I would love to talk about with some people. I have been to therapy and had a talk on Stefan's show years ago but am still fighting some demons deeply ingrained in me.

 

Background:

My parents neglected me my during my entire childhood, they ignored me when I was physically and verbally abused at school/church/home/by my older brother/everywhere. When I was 10 I voiced a concern that I was extremely unhappy with how life was and would not mind dying. I was not asking to die then, I was just stating that I would totally accept that as a finality to escape everything I was forced to deal with.

My parents, being asshats, decided to drug me with SSRI's (when I was 10) which only increased my suicidal thoughts while simultaneously convincing me that I cannot trust my parents to take care of me. I stopped opening up to everyone and everything and was essentially a walking husk from age 10-21. I cried almost every day due to the social isolation/bullying/no empathy from anyone/no one cared about my experiences and other emotionally devastating experiences that would take up far too much room on this post so I will leave it with this: I was told my entire life to man up, stop crying, blah blah blah other completely heartless things a normal person would NEVER say to a victim of physical/emotional abuse. From ages 10-21 I wished for some way to die, not by my hands because my self esteem had been so utterly destroyed I could never bring myself to do such a thing, it would just be a very easy escape from the situations forced on me that will never leave my mind.

 

My issue as of today, I am 25, is that the part of me that was forced to go through those experiences is still with me and he is still emotionally devastated. I have given that entity, I call him childhood me, as much love as I possibly can. I tell him every day that I love him, I support him and we can never go back in time to give ourselves a happy childhood that we should have had. I encourage him, I support him, I NEVER call him names, I don't put him down and I try to treat him as nice as possible because of how terrible I feel for the crap he had to put up with.

 

Despite this self-love, the childhood me still feels like a mutilated rag-doll that has felt such self-hate, external hate, ridicule, humiliation, neglect, cold indifference and isolation he is still opting for the surrender and give up option. I am seeking more therapy but in the long-term the therapies I went through did not seem to curb these thought process.

Please let me know your thoughts, the current me does not want to die. He (current me) wants to fight child abuse to his dying breath but he is forever-more linked to the childhood me who is still suffering from a lack of love/connection in my past.

-Jeremy

 

Motivation for song: NF Let you down

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 2/28/2018 at 10:00 PM, tarker12 said:

Hey yall,

I have been off the forums (was of course still donating) for about 4 years but still on board with FDR's message. I am having some depression issues lately I would love to talk about with some people. I have been to therapy and had a talk on Stefan's show years ago but am still fighting some demons deeply ingrained in me.

 

Background:

My parents neglected me my during my entire childhood, they ignored me when I was physically and verbally abused at school/church/home/by my older brother/everywhere. When I was 10 I voiced a concern that I was extremely unhappy with how life was and would not mind dying. I was not asking to die then, I was just stating that I would totally accept that as a finality to escape everything I was forced to deal with.

My parents, being asshats, decided to drug me with SSRI's (when I was 10) which only increased my suicidal thoughts while simultaneously convincing me that I cannot trust my parents to take care of me. I stopped opening up to everyone and everything and was essentially a walking husk from age 10-21. I cried almost every day due to the social isolation/bullying/no empathy from anyone/no one cared about my experiences and other emotionally devastating experiences that would take up far too much room on this post so I will leave it with this: I was told my entire life to man up, stop crying, blah blah blah other completely heartless things a normal person would NEVER say to a victim of physical/emotional abuse. From ages 10-21 I wished for some way to die, not by my hands because my self esteem had been so utterly destroyed I could never bring myself to do such a thing, it would just be a very easy escape from the situations forced on me that will never leave my mind.

 

My issue as of today, I am 25, is that the part of me that was forced to go through those experiences is still with me and he is still emotionally devastated. I have given that entity, I call him childhood me, as much love as I possibly can. I tell him every day that I love him, I support him and we can never go back in time to give ourselves a happy childhood that we should have had. I encourage him, I support him, I NEVER call him names, I don't put him down and I try to treat him as nice as possible because of how terrible I feel for the crap he had to put up with.

 

Despite this self-love, the childhood me still feels like a mutilated rag-doll that has felt such self-hate, external hate, ridicule, humiliation, neglect, cold indifference and isolation he is still opting for the surrender and give up option. I am seeking more therapy but in the long-term the therapies I went through did not seem to curb these thought process.

Please let me know your thoughts, the current me does not want to die. He (current me) wants to fight child abuse to his dying breath but he is forever-more linked to the childhood me who is still suffering from a lack of love/connection in my past.

-Jeremy

 

Motivation for song: NF Let you down

You are trying to smother your past in love. That is not acceptance. That is not processing. The only way to get past it is to accept that it happened. You don't have to like it, in fact this should piss you off. I hope at the very least that you cut off your horrible parents. Drugging a 10 year-old is an act of extreme aggression and shows that they did not care about you in the slightest. They treated you like a nuisance. If you want to be loved, you must become lovable, and for that to happen you must first fully accept your past. Acceptance doesn't mean being happy about it, just acknowledging that it happened allows you to start figuring out how it is affecting you today. I didn't start socializing until I was 17, so I feel your pain. My mother for 25 years told me that no matter what went wrong, I was the cause of it, and then berated me constantly for not succeeding more in life despite her constant abuse. I left and stopped talking to her, and now I am quite content and working towards happiness. I am both mentally and physically scarred from my childhood, the constant stress even made me chronically ill, but I don't really let any of that control my life despite it limiting what I can still do. The lesson here is that you can't have people in your life whose sole purpose in life is to drag everyone around them down to their level.

I'm working on a translation of the Art of the Argument in my own language. It's going to take a long time, but contributing to something larger than myself has done a lot to make me feel better about the future that I'm helping to shape. I'm sure there's something out there for you too. 

I remember Stefan and Jordan Peterson mentioning Karl Jung, a clinical psychologist, having written books on people who have split part of their personality off of themselves because they aren't connected with it emotionally. Maybe that's an interesting place to start looking for answers? This fracturing of your personality is not good for you, because it disconnects you and prevents you from seeing which of your thoughts and behaviors come from yourself and which come from your past.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 2/28/2018 at 1:00 PM, tarker12 said:

Background:

My parents neglected me my during my entire childhood, they ignored me when I was physically and verbally abused at school/church/home/by my older brother/everywhere. When I was 10 I voiced a concern that I was extremely unhappy with how life was and would not mind dying. I was not asking to die then, I was just stating that I would totally accept that as a finality to escape everything I was forced to deal with.

My parents, being asshats, decided to drug me with SSRI's (when I was 10) which only increased my suicidal thoughts while simultaneously convincing me that I cannot trust my parents to take care of me. I stopped opening up to everyone and everything and was essentially a walking husk from age 10-21. I cried almost every day due to the social isolation/bullying/no empathy from anyone/no one cared about my experiences and other emotionally devastating experiences that would take up far too much room on this post so I will leave it with this: I was told my entire life to man up, stop crying, blah blah blah other completely heartless things a normal person would NEVER say to a victim of physical/emotional abuse. From ages 10-21 I wished for some way to die, not by my hands because my self esteem had been so utterly destroyed I could never bring myself to do such a thing, it would just be a very easy escape from the situations forced on me that will never leave my mind.

I have been to this place. Not only abused within my home, but not heard or protected from the abuse and bullying happening in the neighborhood and at school. As a child of around five or six, I would wander the neighborhood, not wanting to go home because I knew what was waiting for me. Coming in the door, my mother would make me confess everything I had been doing. If she didn't hit me for something I'd done, she would hit me for messing my pants because I would hold it until I couldn't any more, just to keep from going home. While she was hitting me, she would tell me I "made her do it". And this is only an account of my early years.

I know what it feels like to be a husk. Not caring if you live or die. There is a term in the study of behaviorism which is called "Learned Helplessness". It's when an animal cannot escape a random electric shock no matter what they do, and they finally give up trying. Fortunately, because we are humans, we do have the ability to heal.

On 2/28/2018 at 1:00 PM, tarker12 said:

My issue as of today, I am 25, is that the part of me that was forced to go through those experiences is still with me and he is still emotionally devastated. I have given that entity, I call him childhood me, as much love as I possibly can. I tell him every day that I love him, I support him and we can never go back in time to give ourselves a happy childhood that we should have had. I encourage him, I support him, I NEVER call him names, I don't put him down and I try to treat him as nice as possible because of how terrible I feel for the crap he had to put up with.

 

 

I'm glad to hear this. You are showing a wisdom here that I wish I'd had at your age.

Our initial feeling of worth comes from those who raise us. And I will tell you this, you were raised by cruel and toxic people. You were treated like you were worthless. You were treated like the family chew-toy.

Listen to me well right now. You are not worthless. You did nothing to deserve this treatment. If you had been born into a healthy family, you would not be going through this. You were raised within a toxic family dynamic in which any child would have been damaged. This is not your fault and you are not worthless.

On 2/28/2018 at 1:00 PM, tarker12 said:

 

Despite this self-love, the childhood me still feels like a mutilated rag-doll that has felt such self-hate, external hate, ridicule, humiliation, neglect, cold indifference and isolation he is still opting for the surrender and give up option. I am seeking more therapy but in the long-term the therapies I went through did not seem to curb these thought process.

Please let me know your thoughts, the current me does not want to die. He (current me) wants to fight child abuse to his dying breath but he is forever-more linked to the childhood me who is still suffering from a lack of love/connection in my past.

-Jeremy

 

Jeremy,

My parents brought me to the brink of suicide twice. But like you, I realized I did not want to die. I decided I would not let them drive me to destroy myself by my own hand. I know exactly how you feel and please hold on to the thought of surviving in order to help others like us. I don't know Stefan personally, but I know he has also walked a similar path.

Please find a therapist who specializes in helping people recover from Narcissistic Family Abuse. 

There's a discussion forum on the internet called "Out Of The Fog". It is a support forum for people like us. Get over there and just start reading everything they have to offer. You can also join if you need to talk to other survivors. I am member TalenCrowhaven. If you join, you can PM me.

I am not a therapist or a psychiatrist, and there are no therapists or psychiatrists on the site. 

 

Hang in there. You are no longer alone.

 

Digger

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, MercurySunlight said:

I am not a therapist or a psychiatrist, and there are no therapists or psychiatrists on the site. 

Speaking of therapists, there is one therapist I know of that may be of some help. His name is Drew Davis, and you can find him on this forum. I never had any sessions with him, but he seems like a reputable guy. 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi @tarker12

5-Person-floating-above-the-rings-of-Sat

(some art I like, remembered it when checking your profile)

On 03/11/2018 at 11:41 AM, MercurySunlight said:

Listen to me well right now. You are not worthless. You did nothing to deserve this treatment. If you had been born into a healthy family, you would not be going through this. You were raised within a toxic family dynamic in which any child would have been damaged. This is not your fault and you are not worthless.

Upon reading this quote, I thought to myself, the more you see it the higher the chances, it, one day striking bullseye.

I think I remember the call and perhaps I'm wrong, so correct me if I'm mistaken but weren't you asked, if you were connecting with your past on an emotional level? I mean, I seem to recall your voice back then fairly uninvolved and lethargic.

Has therapy had any success bridging that gap?

On 03/10/2018 at 1:43 PM, HenryJubeda said:

[...] accept that it happened. You don't have to like it, in fact this should piss you off. I hope at the very least that you cut off your horrible parents. [...]

One small addition could be, that acceptance isn't a 'have to'. It's optional, entirely. It's within your full and complete control whether you are doing it or not.

And most importantly, it is for your own benefit if you did so. Not mine or anyone else's.

Consider this. If you could help yourself but you chose against it, why would you feel more centered?

Resistance can be a blessing or a challenge. It can prevent negative outcomes the same as positive ones, the only difference being the depth of having internalised what's happening. Probably you have noticed, when people are thinking that conflict may be on the horizon, they avoid and explain away indications that are otherwise clear as day for the rest of us. The fear of something far greater than what really exists paralyse them, over time taking over the whole narrative and resulting in false convictions of 'immovable objects'. It's a process, countering it requires the same amount of steps just the other direction. Slowly, surely chipping away the obstacle with good intentions(self-care) and truth(inoculation against relapse).

There's no magic, shortcuts but it does get easier if you seek truth and not 'how to manage this'.

I'm looking forward to hearing from you, how you are actively doing stuff in the right direction. (right direction = reduce paralysis)

Yet again, fully agree with...

On 03/11/2018 at 11:41 AM, MercurySunlight said:

Hang in there. You are no longer alone.

Barnsley

p.s. (Thanks for all the contributors' quotes, hope you don't mind me borrowing them for a bit.)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 3/10/2018 at 4:43 AM, HenryJubeda said:

You are trying to smother your past in love. That is not acceptance. That is not processing. The only way to get past it is to accept that it happened. You don't have to like it, in fact this should piss you off. I hope at the very least that you cut off your horrible parents. Drugging a 10 year-old is an act of extreme aggression and shows that they did not care about you in the slightest. They treated you like a nuisance. If you want to be loved, you must become lovable, and for that to happen you must first fully accept your past. Acceptance doesn't mean being happy about it, just acknowledging that it happened allows you to start figuring out how it is affecting you today. I didn't start socializing until I was 17, so I feel your pain. My mother for 25 years told me that no matter what went wrong, I was the cause of it, and then berated me constantly for not succeeding more in life despite her constant abuse. I left and stopped talking to her, and now I am quite content and working towards happiness. I am both mentally and physically scarred from my childhood, the constant stress even made me chronically ill, but I don't really let any of that control my life despite it limiting what I can still do. The lesson here is that you can't have people in your life whose sole purpose in life is to drag everyone around them down to their level.

I'm working on a translation of the Art of the Argument in my own language. It's going to take a long time, but contributing to something larger than myself has done a lot to make me feel better about the future that I'm helping to shape. I'm sure there's something out there for you too. 

I remember Stefan and Jordan Peterson mentioning Karl Jung, a clinical psychologist, having written books on people who have split part of their personality off of themselves because they aren't connected with it emotionally. Maybe that's an interesting place to start looking for answers? This fracturing of your personality is not good for you, because it disconnects you and prevents you from seeing which of your thoughts and behaviors come from yourself and which come from your past.

@HenryJubeda,

Thank you so much for responding, I VERY much so appreciate you telling me your story despite how sad it was. I am very sorry you experienced what you did, your mom sounds like an extremely cruel person, I hope you are able to put that behind you someday. I have removed most bad influences from my life but not my parents. I struggle everyday with the thoughts of what to do about my parents, I want to remove them from my life for what they did but they have expressed deep sorrow for what they did to me, they want to have a relationship but I just feel anxiety if I were to be in the same room as them. Their sorrow does not fix anything but it shows me they are capable of remorse and hopefully change.

I think you have a point about the whole acceptance thing. I have been spending any free time the last couple days reflecting on what you said and I think it resonates with me. I need to look deep inward and find out if I really did cause a split in myself. If I did I worry but I know with enough work I can become healthier. I will look into Stefan and Jordan Petersons talks, thank you for the info!

Thank you Henry, thank you so much for helping me in my time of need. I really appreciate it so much :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 3/11/2018 at 3:41 AM, MercurySunlight said:

I have been to this place. Not only abused within my home, but not heard or protected from the abuse and bullying happening in the neighborhood and at school. As a child of around five or six, I would wander the neighborhood, not wanting to go home because I knew what was waiting for me. Coming in the door, my mother would make me confess everything I had been doing. If she didn't hit me for something I'd done, she would hit me for messing my pants because I would hold it until I couldn't any more, just to keep from going home. While she was hitting me, she would tell me I "made her do it". And this is only an account of my early years.

I know what it feels like to be a husk. Not caring if you live or die. There is a term in the study of behaviorism which is called "Learned Helplessness". It's when an animal cannot escape a random electric shock no matter what they do, and they finally give up trying. Fortunately, because we are humans, we do have the ability to heal.

I'm glad to hear this. You are showing a wisdom here that I wish I'd had at your age.

Our initial feeling of worth comes from those who raise us. And I will tell you this, you were raised by cruel and toxic people. You were treated like you were worthless. You were treated like the family chew-toy.

Listen to me well right now. You are not worthless. You did nothing to deserve this treatment. If you had been born into a healthy family, you would not be going through this. You were raised within a toxic family dynamic in which any child would have been damaged. This is not your fault and you are not worthless.

Jeremy,

My parents brought me to the brink of suicide twice. But like you, I realized I did not want to die. I decided I would not let them drive me to destroy myself by my own hand. I know exactly how you feel and please hold on to the thought of surviving in order to help others like us. I don't know Stefan personally, but I know he has also walked a similar path.

Please find a therapist who specializes in helping people recover from Narcissistic Family Abuse. 

There's a discussion forum on the internet called "Out Of The Fog". It is a support forum for people like us. Get over there and just start reading everything they have to offer. You can also join if you need to talk to other survivors. I am member TalenCrowhaven. If you join, you can PM me.

I am not a therapist or a psychiatrist, and there are no therapists or psychiatrists on the site. 

 

Hang in there. You are no longer alone.

 

Digger

 

"You were treated like the family chew-toy."

This was so deep, so accurate and so true regarding my childhood. I got the shit end of the stick from everyone in my life because I was the youngest.

"My parents brought me to the brink of suicide twice. But like you, I realized I did not want to die. I decided I would not let them drive me to destroy myself by my own hand. I know exactly how you feel and please hold on to the thought of surviving in order to help others like us. "

Thank you for the personal story, there is so few people in real life that I can relate to on this topic (suicide) because it is so "taboo". Everyone's personal story in this chat has literally brought me to tears but its strangely nice to read all of your stories and realize that there are strong courageous people like you all, unwilling to give up despite the shit deal you were given. Its motivating and more importantly: infuriating. This anger will fuel my desire to prevent all of our stories from re-occurring as best I can.

The "learned helplessness" hit home more-so than ANYTHING. I looked it up and it matches exactly what I feel and now that I know what it is, in the last few days I have found it much easier to realize when I am feeling that way and accepting that my reaction was programmed into me and can be re-programmed into something else more positive.

 

I will seek "out of the fog", thank you for your support, I am deeply sorry for what you had to endure as a child. Truly and honestly, I am sorry MercurySunlight/Digger. That shit your mom pulled on you is unacceptable and disgusting.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 3/11/2018 at 2:23 PM, barn said:

Hi @tarker12

5-Person-floating-above-the-rings-of-Sat

(some art I like, remembered it when checking your profile)

Upon reading this quote, I thought to myself, the more you see it the higher the chances, it, one day striking bullseye.

I think I remember the call and perhaps I'm wrong, so correct me if I'm mistaken but weren't you asked, if you were connecting with your past on an emotional level? I mean, I seem to recall your voice back then fairly uninvolved and lethargic.

Has therapy had any success bridging that gap?

One small addition could be, that acceptance isn't a 'have to'. It's optional, entirely. It's within your full and complete control whether you are doing it or not.

And most importantly, it is for your own benefit if you did so. Not mine or anyone else's.

Consider this. If you could help yourself but you chose against it, why would you feel more centered?

Resistance can be a blessing or a challenge. It can prevent negative outcomes the same as positive ones, the only difference being the depth of having internalised what's happening. Probably you have noticed, when people are thinking that conflict may be on the horizon, they avoid and explain away indications that are otherwise clear as day for the rest of us. The fear of something far greater than what really exists paralyse them, over time taking over the whole narrative and resulting in false convictions of 'immovable objects'. It's a process, countering it requires the same amount of steps just the other direction. Slowly, surely chipping away the obstacle with good intentions(self-care) and truth(inoculation against relapse).

There's no magic, shortcuts but it does get easier if you seek truth and not 'how to manage this'.

I'm looking forward to hearing from you, how you are actively doing stuff in the right direction. (right direction = reduce paralysis)

Yet again, fully agree with...

Barnsley

p.s. (Thanks for all the contributors' quotes, hope you don't mind me borrowing them for a bit.)

"I think I remember the call and perhaps I'm wrong, so correct me if I'm mistaken but weren't you asked, if you were connecting with your past on an emotional level? I mean, I seem to recall your voice back then fairly uninvolved and lethargic."

Holy sh*t do you remember that talk? It was the first call on the Wednesday show on December 18, 2013 and if you remember that far, your memory skills are amazing. I have definitely been trying to be more emotional since that call (5 years ago), I feel more and I care much more than I ever have. Life is so much different once I stopped existing and started living. I listened to my call within the last couple years and you are right, I was definitely a lot more lethargic back then. I am very curious if we are talking about the same conversation.

As to your therapy question:

Hypno-Therapy helped me connect with my childhood self and give him the love he never got, that was about 20 steps forward in terms of self help in my opinion.

Talk-Therapy did not help me much because I still have yet to meet a therapist I click with (4 different therapists so far), I have yet to have many promising talk therapy sessions that were done with someone other than my girlfriend. I am going to try a new therapist in my area very soon.

"Resistance can be a blessing or a challenge. It can prevent negative outcomes the same as positive ones, the only difference being the depth of having internalised what's happening. Probably you have noticed, when people are thinking that conflict may be on the horizon, they avoid and explain away indications that are otherwise clear as day for the rest of us. The fear of something far greater than what really exists paralyse them, over time taking over the whole narrative and resulting in false convictions of 'immovable objects'. It's a process, countering it requires the same amount of steps just the other direction. Slowly, surely chipping away the obstacle with good intentions(self-care) and truth(inoculation against relapse)."

I wish I understood your entire message. Maybe I'll try to rephrase it and you let me know if I did it right...

It sounds like your trying to say: people see a conflict/challenge and a fear begins to grow, the fear paralyzes people into submission to the point that they are calling the conflict/challenge an 'immovable object'.

Is this is what your trying to get at? I'd love to know because I bet it is a great metaphor.

 

Thank you so much for responding Barnsley, seriously I REALLY appreciate all of your kind thoughts and comments. Let me know if I really am the call in show you were thinking about, I am way too curious.

Once again, thank you to all that responded. I feel the exact opposite of alone. :)

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

Hello @tarker12

16 hours ago, tarker12 said:

Holy sh*t do you remember that talk?

As much as I would like to proudly acknowledge your compliment, I must admit it’s less than that. I did remember a few vague details of the convo; probably it being memorable has to do with some of my personal focus back then. I actually listened to it for the first time somewhere between 1.5 - 2years ago .

 

16 hours ago, tarker12 said:

I feel more and I care much more than I ever have. Life is so much different once I stopped existing and started living.

I really like how you put it. Sounds like you’ve achieved a lot more strength  and curiosity to face challenging questions, taking more responsibility than before.

 

16 hours ago, tarker12 said:

Hypno-Therapy helped me connect with my childhood self and give him the love he never got, that was about 20 steps forward in terms of self help in my opinion.

This is very interesting. I have not heard much about this approach. Does is create bridges between your conscious and unconscious over time?

The other thing I just want to briefly mention, to put it out there (only me is the culprit, not you) is how strange I perceive when you’re referring to  yourself in plural… or rather the fact that it’s a solid persona almost like a lil’ bro you’re taking care of. (Sorry if my way of describing is far from desirable/accurate, feel free to correct me.)

 Is it always like that for you, or occasionally it is malleable and goes in-between stages of stand-alone vs. united and indistinguishable from the whole?

 

16 hours ago, tarker12 said:

Talk-Therapy did not help me much because I still have yet to meet a therapist I click with (4 different therapists so far), I have yet to have many promising talk therapy sessions that were done with someone other than my girlfriend.

Two things have occurred to me while reading these lines.

1.       (I’d assume you had already looked into this angle but one can never know…) Have you given any consideration to the possibility that some of the issues you’re experiencing could be rooted in physical causes? (eating routine & diet, sleeping habit, work-life balance, sufficient and appropriate physical engagement, hormone levels… )

 

 

Could be a flop, but what if with some simple changes you could further aid yourself in achieving/having even more energy, a substantial boost to your daily life?

2.       Finding the right therapist can be a challenge. When I was in therapy, I had changed around the same number of times too and with each new person the overall experience got objectively better. I wrote it up to the simple reason, that when you know more about what you’re looking for, you’ll be better at spotting it/acting assertively to provide it for yourself.

16 hours ago, tarker12 said:

I am going to try a new therapist in my area very soon.

I think that’s the right thing to do. I would do the same. Good for you!

16 hours ago, tarker12 said:

I wish I understood your entire message. Maybe I'll try to rephrase it and you let me know if I did it right...

It sounds like your trying to say: people see a conflict/challenge and a fear begins to grow, the fear paralyzes people into submission to the point that they are calling the conflict/challenge an 'immovable object'.

Is this is what your trying to get at? I'd love to know because I bet it is a great metaphor.

 

Hahaha… Yes, mainly. You summarised it well, generally that’s what I wanted to say.

The other part with the ‘blessing or a challenge’… I just wanted to draw your attention to ‘distinguishing’ and the importance of seeing things for what they are. Having a strict viewpoint regarding beneficial principles is a ‘blessing’ while the same cemented-down mindset when not wanting to face certain issues is ‘a challenge’.

 For starters, it can help if we know at least what we aren’t ready to discuss, try, look into…

i.e. It’s different if I know about myself that at times I’m wasteful and tend to overspend than if I’m dismissive about the topic, never want to even consider the possibility. (as in: ‘’Me? Noooo way…! How do I know? I just know…Pffft,’’ …dismissal. Not good.)

 

Here are a few other conversations that might be of utility for you (do tell):

Question 2, (lies)

Question 1, (on strike)

Question 3, (free will)

Question 5, (common)

Question 1, (bubble)

Question 4, (un/conscious)

Question 4, (kids)

Question 1, (negotiations)

16 hours ago, tarker12 said:

I feel the exact opposite of alone. :)

Keep up the good work!

 

p.s.(edit) {Ooobviously, the links are my ideas on what might be of substance, follow-up realisations... as always, I'm open to the possibility of them not matching with your 'currently-occupied time-space reality' and (*2) as always :happy: looking forward to your feedback/input, whatever it might be.}

Edited by barn
Post Script

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 3/20/2018 at 8:22 AM, barn said:

Hello @tarker12

As much as I would like to proudly acknowledge your compliment, I must admit it’s less than that. I did remember a few vague details of the convo; probably it being memorable has to do with some of my personal focus back then. I actually listened to it for the first time somewhere between 1.5 - 2years ago .

 

I really like how you put it. Sounds like you’ve achieved a lot more strength  and curiosity to face challenging questions, taking more responsibility than before.

 

This is very interesting. I have not heard much about this approach. Does is create bridges between your conscious and unconscious over time?

The other thing I just want to briefly mention, to put it out there (only me is the culprit, not you) is how strange I perceive when you’re referring to  yourself in plural… or rather the fact that it’s a solid persona almost like a lil’ bro you’re taking care of. (Sorry if my way of describing is far from desirable/accurate, feel free to correct me.)

 Is it always like that for you, or occasionally it is malleable and goes in-between stages of stand-alone vs. united and indistinguishable from the whole?

 

Two things have occurred to me while reading these lines.

1.       (I’d assume you had already looked into this angle but one can never know…) Have you given any consideration to the possibility that some of the issues you’re experiencing could be rooted in physical causes? (eating routine & diet, sleeping habit, work-life balance, sufficient and appropriate physical engagement, hormone levels… )

 

 

Could be a flop, but what if with some simple changes you could further aid yourself in achieving/having even more energy, a substantial boost to your daily life?

2.       Finding the right therapist can be a challenge. When I was in therapy, I had changed around the same number of times too and with each new person the overall experience got objectively better. I wrote it up to the simple reason, that when you know more about what you’re looking for, you’ll be better at spotting it/acting assertively to provide it for yourself.

I think that’s the right thing to do. I would do the same. Good for you!

 

Hahaha… Yes, mainly. You summarised it well, generally that’s what I wanted to say.

The other part with the ‘blessing or a challenge’… I just wanted to draw your attention to ‘distinguishing’ and the importance of seeing things for what they are. Having a strict viewpoint regarding beneficial principles is a ‘blessing’ while the same cemented-down mindset when not wanting to face certain issues is ‘a challenge’.

 For starters, it can help if we know at least what we aren’t ready to discuss, try, look into…

i.e. It’s different if I know about myself that at times I’m wasteful and tend to overspend than if I’m dismissive about the topic, never want to even consider the possibility. (as in: ‘’Me? Noooo way…! How do I know? I just know…Pffft,’’ …dismissal. Not good.)

 

Here are a few other conversations that might be of utility for you (do tell):

Question 2, (lies)

Question 1, (on strike)

Question 3, (free will)

Question 5, (common)

Question 1, (bubble)

Question 4, (un/conscious)

Question 4, (kids)

Question 1, (negotiations)

Keep up the good work!

 

p.s.(edit) {Ooobviously, the links are my ideas on what might be of substance, follow-up realisations... as always, I'm open to the possibility of them not matching with your 'currently-occupied time-space reality' and (*2) as always :happy: looking forward to your feedback/input, whatever it might be.}

"This is very interesting. I have not heard much about this approach. Does is create bridges between your conscious and unconscious over time?"

I think what it did was pseudo-time travel to me in my childhood and gave me the love that I had none of growing up. It was like experiencing true love and compassion from someone that cares for the first time. I have no idea if it was supposed to/did bridge between my conscious and unconscious but it definitely did a lot to improve my relationship with myself.

 

"The other thing I just want to briefly mention, to put it out there (only me is the culprit, not you) is how strange I perceive when you’re referring to  yourself in plural… or rather the fact that it’s a solid persona almost like a lil’ bro you’re taking care of. (Sorry if my way of describing is far from desirable/accurate, feel free to correct me.)

 Is it always like that for you, or occasionally it is malleable and goes in-between stages of stand-alone vs. united and indistinguishable from the whole?"

What a awesome question that really made me think. After I thought about this over my entire day, I realized the following: To other people I refer to the childhood self as a third party but when I am in my head talking to him, we are both very very aware that we are one person. In my head I will refer to him as "me" or "Jeremy" which tells me that the two are fundamentally one. I always feel "childhood me's" presence so I do not think the situation in my head is the kind of malleable you were referring to.

"Two things have occurred to me while reading these lines.

1.       (I’d assume you had already looked into this angle but one can never know…) Have you given any consideration to the possibility that some of the issues you’re experiencing could be rooted in physical causes? (eating routine & diet, sleeping habit, work-life balance, sufficient and appropriate physical engagement, hormone levels… )"

ISome of my past issues were because of my routine/lifestyle and I have been correcting those over the last 4 years. I exercise every day, I walk wherever I can in my small town, I meditate or use breathing exercise to calm myself down if I feel anxious and I am a vegetarian because I never want to become fat (not trying to offend anyone). I will continue to tackle keeping my mind and body healthy but that was an excellent point to bring up.

 

As to therapy, I called some around my local area but most have too many patients to handle more. I live in a small area and will continue to pursue the more-therapy option.

 

"For starters, it can help if we know at least what we aren’t ready to discuss, try, look into…"

I have been watching myself for years looking for unconscious choices, when I shy away from something unconsciously my brain usually realizes that I am not consciously making a choice to avoid it. For example, one of my teachers in my Engineering program reminds me of my mom. So my mind found any reason to hate her and recently I realized that I was projecting and realized I was demonizing an another person who some-what acts and looks like my mom. This teacher laughed about her child having anxiety (not cool in my opinion) which was most likely the trigger that started my projection. It was a great realization and I will try to grow from it.

 

I will listen to the shows you linked (the ones I have not heard) when I get some free time soon enough.

Thank you for the awesome back and forth Barnsley!

-Jeremy

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hello @tarker12

 

On 03/23/2018 at 4:17 AM, tarker12 said:

I think what it did was pseudo-time travel to me in my childhood and gave me the love that I had none of growing up. It was like experiencing true love and compassion from someone that cares for the first time. I have no idea if it was supposed to/did bridge between my conscious and unconscious but it definitely did a lot to improve my relationship with myself.

That's an interesting approach, stimuli. Don't know how much truth is in "gave me the love that I had none of growing up" because...

(and please notice, how I'm not saying you didn't have such an experience or that you weren't stating the truth to your best of knowledge... at this point, I'm more than likely to believe you have pretty much described what went on in your mind 1:1...thanks.)

... I dabble a bit in physics and to my current understanding, time-travel requires a lot of 'special, special relativity', in other words, discounting the highly-unlikely (Occam) I am guessing you could have 'imitated' what comforting, attentiveness could've meant in a scenario that you recreated during the session, aimed at 'reliving' a less than perfect recollection, decades later. (I know, I could be wrong here...)

Besides, I have clear memories of having done something similar myself, that ended in ME, crying like a little girl (not that crying, or little girls are diminutive or anything... naturally.)

On 03/23/2018 at 4:17 AM, tarker12 said:

when I am in my head talking to him, we are both very very aware that we are one person. In my head I will refer to him as "me" or "Jeremy" which tells me that the two are fundamentally one. I always feel "childhood me's" presence so I do not think the situation in my head is the kind of malleable you were referring to.

Still creepy, but I obviously still don't fully grasp the whole thing, so please, forgive my discomfort.

Right-o. Not malleable. Context switch? I'm meaning, power-down one, the other kicks in, a combination of some sorts? In situations where an unexpected outcome appears, the previous expectations having shifted brings about a new character for me... i.e. 'I thought I was going to react X, Interestingly I'm experiencing something quite different. What's this?'

On 03/23/2018 at 4:17 AM, tarker12 said:

ISome of my past issues were because of my routine/lifestyle and I have been correcting those over the last 4 years.

Thumbs up!

On 03/23/2018 at 4:17 AM, tarker12 said:

I exercise every day, I walk wherever I can in my small town, I meditate or use breathing exercise to calm myself down if I feel anxious and I am a vegetarian because I never want to become fat (not trying to offend anyone). I will continue to tackle keeping my mind and body healthy[...]  .

Smashin', you are doing much more than I, or the majority because you are actually doing it consciously. (a good reminder, why I should do more of that when I can.) 

On 03/23/2018 at 4:17 AM, tarker12 said:

I live in a small area and will continue to pursue the more-therapy option.

 

It will be sorted out, if you keep at it. During the slow, how 'bout seeing what the good old NATHANIEL BRANDON sentence completion could do for you?

On 03/23/2018 at 4:17 AM, tarker12 said:

I have been watching myself for years looking for unconscious choices, when I shy away from something unconsciously my brain usually realizes that I am not consciously making a choice to avoid it. For example, one of my teachers in my Engineering program reminds me of my mom. So my mind found any reason to hate her and recently I realized that I was projecting and realized I was demonizing an another person who some-what acts and looks like my mom. This teacher laughed about her child having anxiety (not cool in my opinion) which was most likely the trigger that started my projection. It was a great realization and I will try to grow from it.

On an individual level, I think this is gold. Small, heavy and veeery precious to have.

On 03/23/2018 at 4:17 AM, tarker12 said:

I will listen to the shows you linked (the ones I have not heard) when I get some free time soon enough.

I have listened to all of them prior to recommending, again. IT doesn't mean at all, they'll be as useful as I had thought they might be. (no expectations here, just wishing you the best, having  sounded sympathetic back, way then. I think, you know what's best for you.)

On 03/23/2018 at 4:17 AM, tarker12 said:

Thank you for the awesome back and forth Barnsley!

It's always easier to be nice to nice people.

Big, fat, thumbs up, man!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use.