Freedomain Radio

Due to the recent, uh, "interest" in Freedomain Radio from the mainstream media, I have decided to become proactive in dealing with a hate site that obsesses about Freedomain Radio, run by a fellow named Koen Swinkels, who also writes for Lew Rockwell and has presented and studied at the Mises Institute it seems.

Abusive parents congregate over there, and everyone obsessively combs over what I do in order to feed quotes to mainstream reporters. Almost every regular poster there is someone I banned from Freedomain Radio, for reasons which I'm sure will be obvious if you read through the page below, containing quotes from their forum.

This has been going on for about 18 months, and I didn't care too much about it at all, until the mainstream media got involved, and so now I have decided to take the initiative and expose the stuff that goes on over there, just so that people who don't know anything about the history, and the real content of the site, can put things into perspective.

The language that is used is pretty foul, and I don't recommend going through this unless you have some sort of specific interest.

I have posted this link on a variety of libertarian forums. If you could help spread it around, I would really appreciate it.

http://freedomainradio.com/liberating_minds.html

I also wanted to mention, just by the by, that I really do understand people's need or drive to find an "enemy" they can focus on rather than actually dealing with their own life problems. For the last 30 years, my mother has been engaged in an endless series of vitriolic attacks upon the "doctors who are ruining the world" etc etc.

It certainly does give her some temporary relief from anxiety and depression to attack others in this way, but unfortunately it has also completely destroyed her soul, and any capacity she might have for happiness or redemption.

Hatred is a dark road, with a truly dismal and lonely end.

I'll be posting the notice on anti-war.com and anti-state.com tonight. LiMi has already been there.

I generally enjoy the Mises forum -- there are some brilliant people (especially some younger people with incredible minds) -- but I have quit going over there because one member (Giles Stratton) has posted obsessively attacking me for mentioning this site (even mentioning things not even that specific to this site like 'ethics').  Which then lead to trolls from Liberating Minds coming in because of the guardian article being posted.  I'm disappointed more than anything that they weren't banned by the other decent people and it was allowed to go on.  I mean, these people don't have much interest in Misesian or Rothbardian stuff.  I can't imagine they've read those books.

I am very surprised about these people with obsessive anger.  One gentleman that goes by the screen name 'short seller' said to me:  "If I need your opinion, I'll bitchslap it out of you!"

These are very disturbed young people.

I have been reading LiMi, because of this post and they have some arguments that seem valid, as well as those that are completely insane.  Why don't you just ignore them?  I mean, let the media and such say what they want, if you are right, then you shouldn't really care what those who are wrong say.

demosthenes:

I have been reading LiMi, because of this post and they have some arguments that seem valid, as well as those that are completely insane.  Why don't you just ignore them?  I mean, let the media and such say what they want, if you are right, then you shouldn't really care what those who are wrong say.

Stefan Molyneux:

...There are two main reasons that I have now decided to stop ignoring these attacks.

The first is that the mainstream media seems to view this site with some credibility, which I can only assume is because they do not know its vile contents. I also truly hoped that Mr. Swinkels in particular could have found a way to overcome his irrational hatreds and do something more productive with his life. I am aware that revealing his rages in this manner may be devastating for him, and I am truly sorry that this has become the only option that remains.

Secondly, as you can see from the chart below, over the past year, a very small number of people are returning again and again to FDR (and the visits are only currently increasing), and so it is clear that ignoring this problem is only making it worse, and enabling the abusive behavior....

I know I read that, but if they aren't actually coming over here and attacking anymore, then why not leave them alone.  I mean, the Jews and Neo-Nazi's basically leave eachother alone now adays, even with their past

If it were my site and another site was a proximate cause of fewer hits, I'd want to fix that. Especially if donations as a result of people visiting the site were the source of my livelihood.

demosthenes:

I know I read that, but if they aren't actually coming over here and attacking anymore, then why not leave them alone.  I mean, the Jews and Neo-Nazi's basically leave eachother alone now adays, even with their past

I hope I didn't misinterpret you.  Please let me know what you meant if I'm wrong.

John Ess:

I generally enjoy the Mises forum -- there are some brilliant people (especially some younger people with incredible minds) -- but I have quit going over there because one member (Giles Stratton) has posted obsessively attacking me for mentioning this site (even mentioning things not even that specific to this site like 'ethics').  Which then lead to trolls from Liberating Minds coming in because of the guardian article being posted.  I'm disappointed more than anything that they weren't banned by the other decent people and it was allowed to go on.  I mean, these people don't have much interest in Misesian or Rothbardian stuff.  I can't imagine they've read those books.

I am very surprised about these people with obsessive anger.  One gentleman that goes by the screen name 'short seller' said to me:  "If I need your opinion, I'll bitchslap it out of you!"

These are very disturbed young people.

 

There is no point libertarianism talking about the "big ethics" until it can effectively implement the "little ethics." We cannot take a stand against the state if we are afraid to take a stand against verbal abuse...

I thought that by cutting off communications with someone you had proven you were not afraid to handle verbal abuse.  I thought that if you got away, then it didn't matter what was said.  Is that not one of the premises of de-fooing?

demosthenes:

I know I read that, but if they aren't actually coming over here and attacking anymore, then why not leave them alone.  I mean, the Jews and Neo-Nazi's basically leave eachother alone now adays, even with their past

Stefan is leaving them alone in the sense that he's merely defending himself. This is just a page of factual evidence of their behavior which is quite relevant when they are making character attacks against Stefan and bringing them to the mainstream media. You don't consider this whole Guardian fiasco as an attack?

I thought that by cutting off communications with someone you had proven you were not afraid to handle verbal abuse.  I thought that if you got away, then it didn't matter what was said.  Is that not one of the premises of de-fooing?

This isn't the same thing. If that person who was cut off attacked you personally in private, then you would be correct. However, this is not nearly the same. These people are libelling Stefan (see: Guardian). If you cut off communications from someone and then they started telling lies about you to other people that don't know anything about you, you're telling me that you would not care in the slightest? To use your analogy, imagine if neo-Nazi's told all of a Jew's friends and coworkers lies about him.

I find it misleading that you only link to screenshots of posts, which often lack necessary context and further discussion, rather than simply linking to the specific threads on LiMi. For example, when you quote the vulgar posts by Conrad and others, you fail to mention that many of said posts occur in a special sub-forum of LiMi called "Bitch & Complain", which, as I understand it, is intended to be humorous in a vulgar way.

But, even more questionable, you fail to address any of the more (in my opinion) legitimate concerns that the LiMi community has about your and other FDR'ers behaviour. The excessive bannings (admittedly, FDR is your website, so banning is entirely and legitimately up to you. However, I think it is rather conclusive that many such bannings were on grounds of simple disagreement. I refer to Stewart's ban as a most egregious example. I should also concede that many bannings were appropriate.)

That is very interesting -- you joined what, six months ago, and you have only now decided to start posting - and about this issue? I do think it is a shame that nothing we have talked about since April has roused your moral indignation to the point of typing a paragraph -- I could've sworn we dealt with some more serious topics...

Before I respond, though, I'm just curious if you have also posted your moral concerns on Liberating Minds, about what they have done - or if, after reading through the page quoting their 18 months of unprovoked and ugly personal attacks, you find that I am the only person who is worthy of receiving your ethical instructions on right, decent, reasonable and proper behavior?

Thanks!

Stefan Molyneux:

That is very interesting -- you joined what, six months ago, and you have only now decided to start posting - and about this issue? I do think it is a shame that nothing we have talked about since April has roused your moral indignation to the point of typing a paragraph -- I could've sworn we dealt with some more serious topics...

Perhaps you have. My involvement with FDR was and is only as a listener. I suppose I just never got around to posting. I'm not sure what your point is.

Stefan Molyneux:

Before I respond, though, I'm just curious if you have also posted your moral concerns on Liberating Minds, about what they have done - or if, after reading through the page quoting their 18 months of unprovoked and ugly personal attacks, you find that I am the only person who is worthy of receiving your ethical instructions on right, decent, reasonable and proper behavior?

Thanks!

Indeed I have. I refer to this post specifically. Largely, I've concluded based upon their answers that they have some legitimate concerns, hence my post here. And also, I think you misunderstand the importence of this issue for me as a listener of FDR. The question of weather FDR is a cult, or has some "cultish" tendencies, or weather the opinions and conclusions espoused here are correct, is entirely important to someone who is interested in such opinions and conclusions. And hence I come here to express my opinion that your treatment of the matter is largely ineffectual, and misses the point entirely of LiMi.

Well, I am glad that you have been around long enough to know that I don't allow people who post over at that hate site to post over here as well.

It is a simple matter of common decency.

Best of luck with them.