Freedomain Radio

Thanksgiving is full of fun with the family. Yay passive aggression!

My great-aunt asked my siblings and I, "Have any of you called your grandmother?"

1).
I replied, "Are you kidding? You know how she is."
She said, "Well, she is your grandmother..." (paraphrased...I don't remember the details, but this is what her reply amounted to)
I said, "I don't care if she's my grandmother. I don't like her. You know what I did a few weeks ago? She somehow found my cellphone number, called it, and left a message on my voicemail. I called her back and said, go away, leave me alone. Then she got angry and told my father, who got angry at me for her. And it turns out he's the one who gave her my cell #, which she had asked him for. A total set-up, and my dad was going to punish me."

2).
She sad, "Oh yes, she's like that."
"Why in the world do you want me to call her?"
"Can't you just call her and say hi, happy Thanksgiving...?"
"No, the point is that I don't want to talk to her."
"Why don't you want to talk to her?"
"She is messed up!"
"Why don't you just be nice and give her the time of day, just once this year?"
"No, I don't like her, and I know if I were myself around her, she wouldn't like me."
"Hajnal."
"I'm not going to lie. It is a waste of time, seriously."

3).
"And I remember the last time she came to visit. It was a nightmare. The woman, just being in the room with her, she just...sucks up everything around her..."
"Yes, she's very...into herself."
"Into herself, and wants everyone around her to be into her too. She's a black hole, and I don't want to get sucked in. I don't want to be around someone like that."

4).
My great-aunt went on about something like, "...she's still your grandmother and your blood, and you must be loyal to your own blood above all else."
"I don't care about blood, I don't care that she's my grandmother. She's a messed up person, and I don't want to be around her."
"When you get older and more mature and grow more brains, you'll understand..."
"So I'm stupid because I'm young?"

It is physically impossible for me to out-age this old woman and she knows it. What she doesn't know is that age doesn't matter. However, I am 18 years old, a legal adult. I should not be punished for avoiding family members.

I used to think my great-aunt was pretty cool, but after I saw her hanging around and talking to my grandmother, I could never look at her the same way. Now I really don't care about my great-aunt either. She is nicer than my grandmother, but I've lost all respect for her. *crosses off list*

Then there was a cousin - the son of my great-aunt - who came to my room (where I was hiding) and said, "So you're not coming down to say hi or anything? Just going to be all antisocial like that?" he says, half-kidding.
"Yep," I replied.
"Come here and give me a hug," he says.
I hug him,
And he's like, "Come on, what kind of a hug is that?"
And he crushes me in this awkward hug. "You're breaking my neck, man."
"That was the idea."
(Okay. Forget him. *crosses off list*)

Then there's my sister trying to use me for car rides and stuff, but that's another story. *also crosses off list*

It feels good, though. Break off contacts now, defoo later. When I defoo, they'll think I'm the worst person ever. I can't wait.

Oh man I am so sorry, that sounds truly terrible -- is there anyone in your family or extended family who is open to honest communication?

I know exactly where you're coming from... the first half of your post is almost word-for-word the exact same crap I've had to hear for way too long about my grandmothers.  I'm not sure what your age and situation is, but I have to tell you what a relief it was to spend Thanksgiving alone this year.

Every dysfunctional family has the "crazy" people, usually older relatives that are overtly and openly destructive.  It becomes a point of conversation and interaction at family gatherings to discuss the best ways to manage and indulge these people, and it's completely sickening to me.  It's especially disgusting when someone in the family is so clear-headed as to want to simply avoid contact with this crazy person altogether, and you see all the pleading and manipulation that the others use to try and suck the clear person back in.  They so desperately want and need to placate the "crazy" person, and the reasons are so myriad and complex... but they're very dangerous voices to have in your ear, because they're advocating self-abuse, and dressing it up in such a twisted manipulative fashion.

Good luck to you man, it looks like you're seeing their manipulation for what it is.  It can sometimes be frightening and sad to see all of the relationships you thought were reciprocal and loving for what they really are: conditional and platitude-oriented.

Stefan Molyneux:

Oh man I am so sorry, that sounds truly terrible -- is there anyone in your family or extended family who is open to honest communication?

There is only one, I believe... My cousin, and we're pretty close. Other than that, no, I'm afraid not.

Milo:

I know exactly where you're coming from... the first half of your post is almost word-for-word the exact same crap I've had to hear for way too long about my grandmothers.  I'm not sure what your age and situation is, but I have to tell you what a relief it was to spend Thanksgiving alone this year.

Every dysfunctional family has the "crazy" people, usually older relatives that are overtly and openly destructive.  It becomes a point of conversation and interaction at family gatherings to discuss the best ways to manage and indulge these people, and it's completely sickening to me.  It's especially disgusting when someone in the family is so clear-headed as to want to simply avoid contact with this crazy person altogether, and you see all the pleading and manipulation that the others use to try and suck the clear person back in.  They so desperately want and need to placate the "crazy" person, and the reasons are so myriad and complex... but they're very dangerous voices to have in your ear, because they're advocating self-abuse, and dressing it up in such a twisted manipulative fashion.

Good luck to you man, it looks like you're seeing their manipulation for what it is.  It can sometimes be frightening and sad to see all of the relationships you thought were reciprocal and loving for what they really are: conditional and platitude-oriented.

I'm 18...I hope to defoo soon and wish it could happen tomorrow, but the time is not ripe... I think I'll finish therapy first. At least they support me financially, but that's like a prostitute saying "the men I fuck don't love me, but at least they pay me".

I totally agree. And it does make me sad, especially knowing I'll probably leave my younger brother and sister too because they are absorbing the rest of my family's bad behavior like eager sponges. Leaving them will be the worst...as the older sister, I've known them their own lives and watched them grow into what they are.

But I remind myself that there are 6 billion people on the planet I can try my luck with, and then I don't feel so bad. It feels good knowing I'm not obligated to anyone.

There's this GREAT song I think about when it comes to leaving people like that... Right here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IUoUfOK20TE

This made me so sad, we don't have Thanksgiving in the UK, its Xmas that causes the same problems.  Does Thanksgiving make Christmas easier?  I wish i knew how to get away for Christmas, i'm trying to find charity or caring work to do to get away, how do other people manage?